U.S. Plans To Send 150 Tanks To Europe By End of 2015

[Ryan Ruck]

Kind of a drop in the bucket but better than nothing I suppose...

U.S. Plans To Send 150 Tanks To Europe By End of 2015

December 30, 2014

y the end of 2015, the U.S. plans to have nearly 150 tanks and armored vehicles stationed in Europe for use by American troops training in the area, Reuters reported.

Enough military vehicles to equip an armored brigade could be placed in Poland, Romania or the Baltic states - Latvia, Estonia and Lithuania - Lieutenant-General Ben Hodges, commander of the U.S. Army in Europe, told Reuters.

"By the end of ... 2015, we will have gotten all the equipment for a heavy brigade, that means three battalions plus a reconnaissance squadron, the artillery headquarters, engineers, and it will stay in Europe," Hodges said.

"You are talking about 150-ish, maybe 160 M1 tanks, M2 Bradley fighting vehicles, 24 self-propelled howitzers."

The move reassures nervous European allies that NATO will provide protection from a Russian offensive, should it occur. Last month, Hodges said several hundred U.S. troops will remain in Poland and the Baltic states for at least the next year.

Hodges said the decision to bring U.S. support to the area was made two years ago, before Russia annexed Crimea from Ukraine, after Hodges said he noticed that pro-Russian separatists in eastern Ukraine may launch a new offensive.

Most of the equipment will likely remain at U.S. training centers in Germany, but some could be sent to Baltic countries, Poland or Romania, Hodges said. The U.S. currently has 30,000 troops in the area, in addition to a similar number of Air Force, Navy and Marine personnel, according to Reuters.

Earlier this month, Russian President Vladimir Putin signed a new defense doctrine claiming that NATO poses the biggest threat to the country, and said the country has the right to use nuclear weapons to counter any aggression that "threatens the very existence" of Russia, reported the LA Times. The doctrine also paved the way for Moscow to significantly upgrade its military in 2015, including upgrades to its nuclear forces and for expanding its presence in the Arctic.

Russia has responded to NATO military buildup and increased sanctions by increasing its military activity around the globe, including plans to fly bomber patrols in the Gulf of Mexico.

[American Patriot]

I'm not sure of the newest Russian tanks.... but, according to my tanker friends (I have several of them around here at work, who all spent time in First and Second Gulf Wars) said that the Russian stuff was no match to the US stuff.

Unfortunately, I'm hearing (heard?) that they are closing down a vast portion of the tanks down at Carson (where many of them came from for those wars).

[Ryan Ruck]

I'm not sure of the newest Russian tanks.... but, according to my tanker friends (I have several of them around here at work, who all spent time in First and Second Gulf Wars) said that the Russian stuff was no match to the US stuff.

Unfortunately, I'm hearing (heard?) that they are closing down a vast portion of the tanks down at Carson (where many of them came from for those wars).

Well, I think it's safe to say the jury is still out on that.

Frontline US armor has never gone up against frontline Russian armor. The ones we saw in GW1 and GW2 were Russian "monkey models" and even crappier indigenous built Iraqi versions of Russian tanks which we mopped the floor with. Actual frontline Russian tanks will probably fare a lot better though it will probably still take higher numbers of their tanks to match our better quality tanks.

I also found out that the tanks we pulled out of Germany were M1A1SA tanks. The ones going back in mentioned in the article above are upgraded M1A2SEP and M1A2SEPv2 tanks, more capable than the old ones. Still think we need more numbers of them.


Here's a more in depth article...

US Army Plans to Send Abrams Tanks and Bradleys to Eastern Europe

December 1, 2014

The new Army commander in Europe plans to bolster the U.S. armored presence in Poland and the Baltic states and keep rotations of U.S. troops there through next year and possibly beyond to counter Russia.

Lt. Gen. Frederick "Ben" Hodges, who replaced Lt. Gen. Donald M. Campbell earlier this month as commander of U.S. Army Europe, said the Army was looking to add about 100 Abrams tanks and Bradley Fighting Vehicles to the forces in Eastern Europe.

"We are looking at courses of action for how we could pre-position equipment that we would definitely want to put inside a facility where it would be better maintained, that rotational units could then come and draw on it and use it to train, or for contingency purposes," Hodges said in a briefing from Vilnius, Lithuania.

Hodges visited a training site in Lithuania that could be used to store armor and said he would look at similar sites in Estonia and Poland.

"Certainly, I don't see a need to build infrastructure -- a FOB [Forward Operating Base] if you will -- or anything like that, that would be used for U.S. forces," Hodges said.

Since taking command, Hodges has made clear his concerns about Russia, which annexed Crimea last March and has supported the separatists in eastern Ukraine. U.S. Army Europe, which had 280,000 troops at the height of the Cold War, now has 31,000.

The rotations of U.S. troops on training missions in Eastern Europe would provide "deterrence against Russian aggression," Hodges said.

"I don't think that Russia has any intention of some sort of a conventional attack into NATO territory because they know that would generate an Article 5 response."

He referred to the NATO treaty article calling on all member states to respond to an attack on any member of the alliance. Poland, Lithuania, Estonia and Latvia are all members of the 28-member NATO alliance.

"I think that what they [the Russians] do want to do is to create that ambiguity, plant the seeds of uncertainty so that the alliance members lose confidence that the rest of the alliance would come to their aid if they were, in fact, attacked," Hodges said.

Two days after Hodges spoke, Air Force Gen. Philip Breedlove, the NATO commander, visited Ukraine to discuss U.S. and NATO assistance in shoring up defenses against the separatists.

Moscow has repeatedly denied sending troops into eastern Ukraine and providing advanced arms and equipment to the separatists, but Breedlove said that Russian troops definitely were present in eastern Ukraine and were "giving backbone" to the rebels.

Breedlove said Russian forces were also training the rebels to "understand the advanced weaponry that is being brought across."

The central government in Kiev led by President Petro Poroshenko has been pleading with the U.S. for advanced weaponry to counter the Russian troops and rebels, but the U.S. has limited assistance to non-lethal aid.

Speaking on background, a senior administration official traveling with Vice President Joe Biden on his trip to Ukraine last week said the U.S. has provided more than $100 million in non-lethal assistance "to help the Ukrainians defend themselves."

The aid included night-vision goggles;protective vests; counter-mortar radars; blankets; vehicles; and Meals, Ready to Eat, the official said. The official said the U.S. had concluded that arming Ukraine would be counter-productive since "no matter how many weapons we provided to Ukraine, they were going to get outgunned by the Russians."

Since the pro-Russian rebels seized border regions last April, more than 4,300 combatants and civilians have been killed in eastern Ukraine and nearly a million people have fled the region, according to the United Nations.

Thankfully the Poles have seen the writing on the wall and have ramped up their military big time. They actually field an arguably better military than Germany currently. Plus their troops have been getting a lot of real world trigger time alongside ours in Afghanistan.

When the party kicks off in Europe, they're going to be a big asset.

[Avvakum]

Well, I think it's safe to say the jury is still out on that.

Frontline US armor has never gone up against frontline Russian armor. The ones we saw in GW1 and GW2 were Russian "monkey models" and even crappier indigenous built Iraqi versions of Russian tanks which we mopped the floor with. Actual frontline Russian tanks will probably fare a lot better though it will probably still take higher numbers of their tanks to match our better quality tanks.

I also found out that the tanks we pulled out of Germany were M1A1SA tanks. The ones going back in mentioned in the article above are upgraded M1A2SEP and M1A2SEPv2 tanks, more capable than the old ones. Still think we need more numbers of them.


Here's a more in depth article...

US Army Plans to Send Abrams Tanks and Bradleys to Eastern Europe

December 1, 2014

The new Army commander in Europe plans to bolster the U.S. armored presence in Poland and the Baltic states and keep rotations of U.S. troops there through next year and possibly beyond to counter Russia.

Lt. Gen. Frederick "Ben" Hodges, who replaced Lt. Gen. Donald M. Campbell earlier this month as commander of U.S. Army Europe, said the Army was looking to add about 100 Abrams tanks and Bradley Fighting Vehicles to the forces in Eastern Europe.

"We are looking at courses of action for how we could pre-position equipment that we would definitely want to put inside a facility where it would be better maintained, that rotational units could then come and draw on it and use it to train, or for contingency purposes," Hodges said in a briefing from Vilnius, Lithuania.

Hodges visited a training site in Lithuania that could be used to store armor and said he would look at similar sites in Estonia and Poland.

"Certainly, I don't see a need to build infrastructure -- a FOB [Forward Operating Base] if you will -- or anything like that, that would be used for U.S. forces," Hodges said.

Since taking command, Hodges has made clear his concerns about Russia, which annexed Crimea last March and has supported the separatists in eastern Ukraine. U.S. Army Europe, which had 280,000 troops at the height of the Cold War, now has 31,000.

The rotations of U.S. troops on training missions in Eastern Europe would provide "deterrence against Russian aggression," Hodges said.

"I don't think that Russia has any intention of some sort of a conventional attack into NATO territory because they know that would generate an Article 5 response."

He referred to the NATO treaty article calling on all member states to respond to an attack on any member of the alliance. Poland, Lithuania, Estonia and Latvia are all members of the 28-member NATO alliance.

"I think that what they [the Russians] do want to do is to create that ambiguity, plant the seeds of uncertainty so that the alliance members lose confidence that the rest of the alliance would come to their aid if they were, in fact, attacked," Hodges said.

Two days after Hodges spoke, Air Force Gen. Philip Breedlove, the NATO commander, visited Ukraine to discuss U.S. and NATO assistance in shoring up defenses against the separatists.

Moscow has repeatedly denied sending troops into eastern Ukraine and providing advanced arms and equipment to the separatists, but Breedlove said that Russian troops definitely were present in eastern Ukraine and were "giving backbone" to the rebels.

Breedlove said Russian forces were also training the rebels to "understand the advanced weaponry that is being brought across."

The central government in Kiev led by President Petro Poroshenko has been pleading with the U.S. for advanced weaponry to counter the Russian troops and rebels, but the U.S. has limited assistance to non-lethal aid.

Speaking on background, a senior administration official traveling with Vice President Joe Biden on his trip to Ukraine last week said the U.S. has provided more than $100 million in non-lethal assistance "to help the Ukrainians defend themselves."

The aid included night-vision goggles;protective vests; counter-mortar radars; blankets; vehicles; and Meals, Ready to Eat, the official said. The official said the U.S. had concluded that arming Ukraine would be counter-productive since "no matter how many weapons we provided to Ukraine, they were going to get outgunned by the Russians."

Since the pro-Russian rebels seized border regions last April, more than 4,300 combatants and civilians have been killed in eastern Ukraine and nearly a million people have fled the region, according to the United Nations.

Thankfully the Poles have seen the writing on the wall and have ramped up their military big time. They actually field an arguably better military than Germany currently. Plus their troops have been getting a lot of real world trigger time alongside ours in Afghanistan.

When the party kicks off in Europe, they're going to be a big asset.

Let's hope it never comes to that, I don't want any Pole dying for the EU or any American for Obama because he wants Nazis in charge in the Ukraine and Islamists in Syria.