Oklahoma City 4/19/95: Stop the Charade now!

[Sean Osborne]

Special Reports : Congressional Hearings to be Held in 1995 OKC Bombing

By Douglas J. Hagmann, Director
director@homelandsecurityus.com

“We search for the truth. We seek justice. The courts require it. The victims cry for it. And God demands it.” -- The words of OKC Rescue Team 5 spray painted on the heavily damaged Murrah building.

HOWEVER...

* Congressman Leading Hearings on Middle Eastern “Payroll”

* Crucial Witnesses Will NOT Be Called

* The 171 Victims of the April 19, 1995 Terrorist Attack Will Again be Victimized





You CAN make a difference - Please sign our Petition

11 June 2006: Think of the questionable ethics and corruption illustrated in the 1979 movie “And Justice For All,” apply that basic premise to the upcoming Congressional hearings investigating the Oklahoma City terrorist attack of 1995, and you will have a good idea how the hearings are going to play out. Somebody, with the vigor and passion of Al Pacino, needs to point out to Congressman Rohrabacher that he, and his entire subcommittee under which the hearings are to be conducted, is “out of order.”

It was announced last week that Representative Henry Hyde (R-Ill), has authorized hearings to determine whether there was any “foreign involvement” in the 1995 bombing. Hyde has given Rohrabacher's Oversight and Investigations Subcommittee of the House International Relations Committee the authority to conduct interviews and subpoena documents related to the April 19, 1995, terrorist attack that murdered 171 dead, 22 of them children (3 unborn), and injured over 800 more. Unfortunately, the victims and their families of the vicious 1995 terrorist attack will be victimized again, this time by the duplicity of those who will be involved in those hearings.

The Northeast Intelligence Network has provided extensive investigative coverage on the Oklahoma City Bombing. Additionally, after an extensive review of the open source investigative information published by various sources, it is the qualified opinion of the professional investigators who make up the Northeast Intelligence Network that the sole and most comprehensive authoritative investigative work about the April 19th, 1995 bombing is The Third Terrorist written by Jayna Davis. It methodically makes the case that Middle Eastern terrorists had an active role in the murder of 171 Americans in the worst terrorist attack on U.S. soil to that date. Sadly, twenty-two witnesses who were located, vetted, and interviewed by Ms. Davis who could provide the evidence of a direct connection to Middle Eastern terrorists will not be called to testify - at least not without YOUR help.

Please sign our Petition



** Link to our April 4, 2006 Article

** Link to SPECIAL PODCAST with Jayna Davis

SPECIAL REPORT: ANOTHER POTENTIAL TO WEEP (PDF FILE)

[Aplomb]

Done, Sean. How can this help? And why is this happening, anyway?

[Sean Osborne]

Done, Sean. How can this help? And why is this happening, anyway?

It is hoped that the petition will bring enough pressure to bear on Congressman Rohrabacher to force the inclusion of Jayna Davis' 22 witnesses to testify under oath on the Middle Eastern terrorists had an active role in the murder of 171 Americans in the worst terrorist attack on U.S. soil to that date.

If these witness are called to testify then these Middle Eastern men can be proven in a court of law to be Iraqi soldiers and intelligence operatives of the Iraqi al-mukhabarat. They still live in the US unfettered by federal LE. It can be proven that McNichols also met repeatedly in the Philippines with Al Qaeda terrorist handlers. McVeigh was a treasonous pawn and a stooge - funny how he's the only one who had to die ASAP afterwards. This would also prove a working and cooperative relationship between Iraq and Al Qaeda dating to 1994.

This hearing as currently scheduled is nothing more than a RepubliCrat charade built upon some of the most disgusting political expediency I have ever seen. This is the same thing we're seeing regarding AFOSI special agent Dave Gaubatz and Iraqi WMD still in Iraq. Thankfully the CIA is about to become fully engaged in that issue.

SIGN THE PETITION ... and remember, this is an election year.

We the People, By the People For the People - do not forget that.

Engage in the process to save America. Be a part of the solution.

[American Patriot]

Sean, you're starting to sound... well... conspiratorial

[Sean Osborne]

Sean, you're starting to sound... well... conspiratorial

Rick,

LOL. I sound conspiratorial? LOL.

1. Have you read (or heard the audio file posted within a thread here) of the FACT that the FBI refused to accept Jayna Davis entire dosier of sworn witness afadavits due to political considerations?

OKC was "domestic terrorism" my heinie. A whole platoon of Iraqi soldiers and agents were involved as well as Al Qaeda oversight of McNichols planning.

2. Or the factual case I'm on at present concerning AFOSI agent (Ret.) Paul 'Dave" Gaubatz and his AFOSI WMD search teams (and you know as well as I do that AFOSI field agents are the best in the world at what they do - bar none) findings in Iraq not being followed up, secured and exploited due to "political considerations".

Three full years after locating and reporting geo-coordinates on four separate Iraqi WMD cashes in southern Iraq, and what we have here are the promises of direct action by two strident republican Congressman - who left politically expedient "bail-out" clauses caveated to their support - and a face-to-face meeting with the CIA scheduled for tomorrow in Dallas, TX to discuss the issue.

The public is left with "There were no WMD" in Iraq. Meanwhile the WMD lies in those Iraqi bunkers for 3 years - we hope untouched by insurgents.

3. The documented Agency "working papers and intelligence assesment" which detailed the existing and extensive cooperation between the regime of Saddam Hussein and Al Qaeda from 1990 through to 2001 (which includes WTC-I in 1993, OKC in 1995 and 9/11).

And this is not common knowledge?

Instead we have "there was no pre-existing Iraq-Al Qaeda cooperation; OKC was domestic terrorism, Bush invaded in 2003 and then the Al Qaeda terrorists flooded into Iraq".


All three of these specific issues have a common thread of Iraqi and/or Al Qaeda terrorist involvement.


All three of these factual real-world issues are suppressed to one degree or another not by "tptb", but due to political expediency.


"Conspiracies" don't usually have hard facts buttressing them do they?

Perhaps I should just quit all this nonsense and pound Guineses on the weekend and let all this be... because... well... it sounds conspiratorial.

Yeah, that's the whole point... make 'em sound conspiratorial and these issues are bound to be left as dust on the trail behind us. Nuthin' to see here folks... move along. Deception complete.

Got a cold one handy?

[Brian Baldwin]

Well being anti-conspiratorial doesn't have to mean there are no conspiracies. We know there are. The difference is we show indisputable facts pointing at the conspiracy or we shut the hell up. So in essence we are what the journalists should be. We do our homework and make sure of our allegations before we jump in and create havoc.

I don't think Sean is being conspiratorial here because of the access to proper intel he has and has in turn provided to us. I believe there is a very good possiblity he is dead on 100% correct in this. Of course my believing won't make it any more or less correct. I just agree that they need to look into the affidavits. After all we wouldn't have believed 9/11 could happen here if it hadn't. So its very possible that they were tied into OKC also.

We all know that with any real conspiracy that we will never see this happen. We all know that it would give several high ups very black eyes. Cover-ups are nothing new in this country and have been around since it's begining. I agree with Sean but I admit it will never take place. Because the fact is that these witness' should have been listened to at the start and including in the investigation. That way if they had come to the conclusion of "domestic terrorism" then they could point to that and say this is why.

The reason I've gone to such extents to explain my reason for thinking this way isn't to try an help prove what Sean is saying but more that I'm trying to make sure we as a nation know the full impact of this War on Terrorism. It's actually a war on Islam and there are no allies amongst them in my mind. And that is a conspirtorial statement.

[American Patriot]

Didn't say Sean was BEING Conspiratorial. I said he SOUNDED like it.

It was a joke, and I have read a lot of this material. At this point though, the jury is out for me on several issues. One of them, why they executed McVey so quickly. I'm not sure that was a good thing, or a bad thing. He admitted to doing it, and that's pretty much that.

I don't believe ANYONE in the world, not even a kook, would take the responsibility for killing a lot of people in a bombing like that unless they really did it. The circumstances of his arrest, and the evidence against him was insurmountable.

Whether it was one of those "too quick things" -- that's another story. I know there are states with people on Death Row who've been there for 10 years. Colorado is one of them.

On the other hand, that was a FEDERAL trial and there aren't that many people on death row at any given time. There's a list of them here: http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/arti...cid=29&did=193

Most are scheduled kind of quickly if you ask me. But then again, thats what "speedy trials" are all about, huh?

Was there a "John Doe II"? I think so. I think there were probably a lot of other folks involved in that. On the other hand, we've not heard from or found them and they haven't bragged much. If they had, they'd have been discovered. A saying goes, "Two men can keep a secret, if one of them is dead". I've variously heard this attributed to Ben Franklin and Thomas Jefferson --- not really sure who said it (looked this morning but couldn't find it).

Anyway, the point here is simple. Conspiracies are really NOT conspiracies. If they are known, then they are no longer conspiracies. Governments in general can't keep secrets very well. Why do you all think we have protocols in place to PROTECT secrets? Because people blabber all the time to their spouses, in bars, to their drinking buddies when they are bragging. Certainly, there are a lot of secrets out there. But the fact is, if there are a lot of people involved in OKC one day, we will know the facts behind it.

[Sean Osborne]

Didn't say Sean was BEING Conspiratorial. I said he SOUNDED like it. It was a joke, and I have read a lot of this material.

Roger that, I knew it was tongue-in-cheek and I LOL'd twice because of it.

Then again, as I pointed out, there is some very serious information which I am and have long been talking about which is 100% fact based information. Political expediency and national security are no joke - friggin' or otherwise, and as stuck I am dealing with them in that specific venue. I know, Rick Donaldson of all people, understands ALL of this in detail.

Linking the data I posted to anything resembling "conspiracy theory" or akin to that label is a non-starter for me. That is where I draw the line. Liberals and Leftists regularly utilize that tactic to diffuse and/or obfuscate the real tangible truths we are dealing within this subject matter - WMD, Iraq, OIF. OKC, WTC-I, 9/11 snd the current terrorist threat. The same goes for Republican's in elected office. I WILL NOT TOLERATE POLITICAL EXPEDIENCY FROM THEM EITHER - PARTICULARLY THE REPUBLICANS.

I needed to clarify that the "sounds conspiratorial" is in fact anything but.

McVeigh was a "lily white" patsy. His personal rational for doing what he did is irrelevant to me - that he was part of a larger Islamic terrorist and Iraqi Intelligence (al-Mukhabarat) operation is extremely germane.

On the other hand, that was a FEDERAL trial...

Exactly. And that sham trial was conducted during Bubba's (Bill Clinton's) Administration with his Department of Justice running the show and his pointmen on-the-ground in OKC running interference and suppressing evidence. That's police state mentaility in action and an obstruction of justice.

What Jayna Davis wants, what I want, what NEIN is demanding is an all witnesses included, special prosecutor, open to the public hearing and trial. We want and demand the truth and we're determined to pursue any and all COA (coarses-of-action) everything within our ability to Git"R"Done.

As it currently exists, Congressman Dana Rorhabacher's hearing is a mere shell game of the real issues.

[Sean Osborne]

Ladies and gentlemen, buckle your seatbelts. We are about to experience some turbulence.


http://www.homelandsecurityus.com/OKC122706a

Breaking Exclusive: Investigative Reporter Exposes Congressional Whitewash of the OKC Bombing Report

By Douglas J. Hagmann, Director

"As a 21-year veteran investigator and based on my extensive review of the evidence secured, authenticated and possessed by Ms. Davis in comparison with investigative results of Congressman Dana Rohrabacher, the congressman couldn't investigate his way out of a wet paper bag."–Doug Hagmann, Director, Northeast Intelligence Network


27 December 2006: In an exclusive interview with the Northeast Intelligence Network – her first and only interview since the release of a Congressional investigative report last Friday pertaining to the terrorist bombing of the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing that took the lives of 168 people and 3 unborn children, award-winning investigative journalist, and the foremost expert on the bombing, Jayna Davis, author of the best-selling book The Third Terrorist, adeptly exposes the blatant deficiencies of the incoherent, poorly researched, and jumbled "investigative" congressional report. With the deadly proficiency of a skilled marksman, Ms. Davis, methodically shoots down the critical findings that comprise the essence of this congressional report and successfully makes the case that the report represents a betrayal of justice to each and every victim of the April 19, 1995 bombing and betrays the trust of every citizen of the United States.


The report made few headlines when it became public last Friday due to its overall lack of investigative value and conclusive merit. Congressman Dana Rohrabacher, who spearheaded the "investigation" that reportedly took him two years to conduct at the expense of the taxpayers has been billed as an independent examination of a possible foreign connection, but in reality, has amounted to nothing more than the fruitless pursuit of repudiated conspiracy theories blatantly devoid of any conclusive findings.



In early 2005, Rohrabacher publicly announced that he was looking into the evidence set forth in the book, The Third Terrorist, which documents the sworn testimonies of twenty-two-(22) eyewitnesses who implicated a Middle Eastern terrorist cell aiding and abetting Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols in the plot to destroy the Alfred P. Murrah Building The Third Terrorist, written by the foremost authority on the facts of the bombing, former investigative reporter and bestselling author of the most comprehensive book about the terrorist attack, details evidence presented by Ms. Davis but not acted upon by the U.S. Justice Department, evidence that has been unscathed by intense scrutiny and earned the endorsements of a number of credible former intelligence officials. The problem, however, is that Congressman Rohrabacher failed to address the most academic and compelling facts of the worst terrorist attack on U.S. soil until that time, opting instead to pursue a long disregarded theory of a neo-Nazi connection – a theory that was not only dispelled, but labeled as "hyperbole" and a "dry hole" by a sitting Oklahoma Judge who heard the related testimony during the trial of bombing co-conspirator Terry Nichols over 2 years ago.


Evidence presented by Ms. Davis in her book and offered directly to the Congressman is so compelling that it could easily make a prima facia case for Middle Eastern involvement in the bombing. The evidence uncovered by Ms. Davis offers detailed witness accounts of a former Iraqi Republican Guardsman identified as Hussain Al-Hussaini being seen in the presence of Timothy McVeigh prior to the bombing, getting our of the bomb-laden Ryder truck the morning of April 19, and fleeing the Murrah Building in a vehicle identified and pursued by the FBI in an all-points-bulletin issued for Middle Eastern terrorists. More significantly, two federal court rulings establish that this Iraqi soldier has no provable alibi for the morning of the bombing. Overwhelming and fully substantiated evidence developed by Ms. Davis was deliberately sidestepped by the congressman as she predicted in an interview with the Northeast Intelligence Network almost a year ago.


Noting that Rohrabacher was offered clearly outlined, well-researched, thoroughly vetted and highly credible evidence that provided a definite Middle Eastern connection to the bombing, a position envied by any legitimate investigator, Ms. Davis points out that Congressman Rohrabacher ignored that evidence and instead, chose a different investigative path. "Congressman Rohrabacher has expended the majority of his investigative energy and dollars chasing decade-old phantoms and empty leads, trying to implicate dead or imprisoned suspects who were officially cleared by the government years ago," stated Ms. Davis.


Speaking to the blatant impotence and incompetence of the congressman’s investigation, Ms. Davis added, "Much to my bewilderment, the Congressman has not yet demanded that the FBI fully investigate the multiple sightings of Iraqi Republican Guardsman Hussain Al-Hussaini in the presence of Timothy McVeigh prior to the bombing, exiting the bomb-laden Ryder truck the morning of April 19, and escaping the ill-fated Murrah Building in a getaway vehicle pursued by the FBI in an all-points-bulletin issued for Middle Eastern terrorists."


The Oklahoma City Bombing investigation appeared to be managed at the highest levels of the government from the very beginning, only to be managed again a decade later by a transparent and deceptive dog-and-pony show by a Congressman who deliberately ignored facts that could prove the well-researched conclusion that Islamic terrorists inside the U.S. were complicit in the 1995 bombing. The facts that were ignored by the Congressman in his amateurish report were so potentially important that had they been properly investigated, they could prove malfeasance at various levels of government, from the FBI to the U.S. Justice Department to some of the highest elected officials in the U.S. Facts that if handled contemporaneously, could have proven to be the proverbial canary in the mine warning of the terrorist attack of September 11, 2001.


It is unconscionable to accept that the FBI never interviewed a primary Middle-Eastern suspect in the Oklahoma City bombing about the bombing itself, never issued an official on-the-record statement exonerating him of complicity in the Oklahoma City bombing, and despite the numerous questions surrounding the ties and activities of this individual, did nothing as he gained employment following April 19, 1995 but before September 11, 2001 at Boston-Logan airport – an airport where two of the 9/11 hijacked planes originated.


Additionally, Congressman Rohrabacher never addressed the curious actions of the FBI when they outright refused delivery of twenty-two witness statements and supporting evidence in September 1997 – statements that consistently and clearly substantiated the involvement of men of Middle Eastern appearance with the primary actors McVeigh and Nichols. Having complete knowledge of the witness statements and later, sworn affidavits, the investigating congressman never asked why the FBI withheld those twenty-two witness affidavits Ms. Davis delivered to FBI Special Agent Dan Vogel in January 1999 from the defense teams of Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols.


The Congressman also failed to acknowledge the fact that the FBI assumed physical custody of original motel registration logs where witnesses testified McVeigh checked in with the Middle Eastern suspect, an Iraqi national identified as Hussein al Hussaini on the evening of April 18, 1995, but never returned those original documents to the establishment's owner. By not doing so, the evidence of the Iraqi suspect's presence at the motel could [not] be conclusively verified.


Also failing in his investigation, the congressman never addressed the disposition of the brown Chevrolet pickup truck that was seen carrying Middle Eastern suspects from the bomb site at the time of the bombing. It is important to note that the Oklahoma City police recovered fingerprints inside the truck, however federal officials never compared those prints to the immigration files of three Middle Eastern nationals, the identities who were known to authorities, and who witnesses observed in that vehicle traveling from the Murrah Building before, during, and after the bombing.

[Segestan]

Islamist agents or faithfuls present BOTH sides of a story , though not ALL; leaving the reader with the ideas of choosing the truth freely , of either tales False story line. Odds being very good that over time the readers themselves with constant agent support in private and government positions will thus establish an All New history line. The facts being Not in those Lines. An age old Tactic. But why use Arabs in the bombing at all? Theirs many faithfuls who are Not of the arab muslims racial stock , an obvious mistake, who could have freely done the job? If their were middle eastern agents on the site than that was a gross error by the agents planning team. Still something missing in this story line.

[Sean Osborne]

Segestan,

Your barely coherent response is just coherent enough for me to attain the understanding that you are woefully ill-informed on the subject matter regarding the investigation and salient discovered FACTS surrounding the April 19, 1995 terrorist assault on the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City.

Hussein al-Husseini was and is no Islamist terrorist.

Hussein al-Husseini was and remains an agent of the former regime of Saddam Hussein. He is a die-hard Ba'athist assassin as are his fellow Iraqi Republican Guard soldier buddies who remain in close proximity to him in the Boston, MA metropolitan area.

Terry Nichol's met with and recieved technical bomb-making data in the Philippines on a couple of occasions from a Baluchi member of the Al Qaeda organization, who was also a covert agent for the Iraqi al-Mukhabarat agency, one "Ramzi Yousef", a relative of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed ("KSM").

What is missing in the "story line" is what is missing in your own knowledge of the entire affair. Go read the book in a library and get educated.

[Sean Osborne]

http://www.jaynadavis.com/highlights.html


The most incriminating testimony centers around former Iraqi soldier, Hussain Al-Hussaini, whom witnesses place in the company of bomber Timothy McVeigh prior to the blast, seated in the passenger seat of the Ryder truck the morning of April 19, exiting that truck at ground zero, and speeding away from the bomb site in the only getaway vehicle targeted by the FBI in an all-points-bulletin for Middle Eastern suspects. Al-Hussaini has been unable to establish his whereabouts for the critical hours of that fateful morning, and more glaringly, the Justice Department has declined to officially exonerate him of suspicion.




Deconstructing the murky past of the accused paves a trail of clues leading from the plains of Oklahoma to the sands of Iraq. Hussain Al-Hussaini, a self-professed insurrectionist, told the press that he had been imprisoned for publicly criticizing the Butcher of Baghdad. But Al-Hussaini's woeful tale of "persecution" under the tyrannical reign of ousted Iraqi despot, Saddam Hussein, does not stand up to scrutiny.
Was the Iraqi expatriate a dissident or disciple? After copious examination of Al-Hussaini's immigration records and his emblematic military tattoos, defense analysts have reached a disquieting determination: the man, whom witnesses named as the infamous third terrorist, was not a rank-and-file infantryman.


Colonel Patrick Lang, a Middle East expert who formerly served as the chief of human intelligence for the Defense Intelligence Agency, believes Hussain Al-Hussaini would have been counted among Saddam's elite fighting forces.

"Our conclusion would be that this guy (Al-Hussaini) had been a member of either the Special Troops Division of the Iraqi Military Intelligence or the Adnan Division of the Republican Guard," Colonel Lang firmly asserted. The ex-military intelligence chief postulated that Al-Hussaini's purported history as a political dissenter was "complete nonsense," but the story, in his opinion, served as a clever means to facilitate infiltration into the United States as a false defector and Iraqi intelligence agent. "This guy is clearly not a refugee ... none of that fits with his tattoo."



"I have compared this (Jayna Davis' investigation) to all human intelligence I have looked at, and in comparing that to classified material, this is not just one witness. This is not just two witnesses. You're talking about twenty-three people," stated Larry Johnson, a former CIA analyst and deputy director of counterterrorism for the U.S. Department of State. In March 2002, Johnson succinctly summarized the enormity of evidence implicating the Middle East before a nationwide television audience.

"You're talking about at least ten people that put Tim McVeigh with Hussain Al-Hussaini before the Oklahoma City bombing. Two people who identify Hussain Al-Hussaini (with McVeigh) in a bar on April 15. Three people who identify Hussaini Al-Hussaini running from the federal building early in the morning of April 19 at 5:30 A.M. as he is practicing timing himself. You have two witnesses that put Tim McVeigh with Hussain Al-Hussaini in the Ryder truck. You have one witness inside the Murrah Building who sees Hussain Al-Hussaini getting out of the truck ... .and he is seen driving away from the building," Johnson declared on the Fox News Channel, "My concern is that this angle was never pursued, and to this day, the FBI has refused to exonerate this man. They have refused to go out and check out his alibis."

[vector7]

Not to stir conspiracy but this just showed up on the radar from out of no where

Attorney: Oklahoma City bomb tapes appear edited

By TIM TALLEY, Associated Press Writer Tim Talley, Associated Press Writer – Mon Sep 28, 7:15 am ET



Play Video WWL-TV, Channel 4 New Orleans – Raw: FBI's previously unreleased Oklahoma City bombing tapes

OKLAHOMA CITY – Long-secret security tapes showing the chaos immediately after the 1995 bombing of the Oklahoma City federal building are blank in the minutes before the blast and appear to have been edited, an attorney who obtained the recordings said Sunday.

"The real story is what's missing," said Jesse Trentadue, a Salt Lake City attorney who obtained the recordings through the federal Freedom of Information Act as part of an unofficial inquiry he is conducting into the April 19, 1995, bombing that killed 168 people and injured hundreds more.

Trentadue gave copies of the tapes to The Oklahoman newspaper, which posted them online and provided copies to The Associated Press.

The tapes turned over by the FBI came from security cameras various companies had mounted outside office buildings near the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building. They are blank at points before 9:02 a.m., when a truck bomb carrying a 4,000 pound fertilizer-and-fuel-oil bomb detonated in front of the building, Trentadue said.

"Four cameras in four different locations going blank at basically the same time on the morning of April 19, 1995. There ain't no such thing as a coincidence," Trentadue said.

He said government officials claim the security cameras did not record the minutes before the bombing because "they had run out of tape" or "the tape was being replaced."

"The interesting thing is they spring back on after 9:02," he said. "The absence of footage from these crucial time intervals is evidence that there is something there that the FBI doesn't want anybody to see."

A spokesman for the FBI in Oklahoma City, Gary Johnson, declined to comment and referred inquiries about the tapes to FBI officials in Washington, who were not immediately available for comment Sunday.

The soundless recordings show people rushing from nearby buildings after the bomb went off. Some show people fleeing through corridors cluttered with debris. None show the actual explosion that ripped through the federal building.

FBI agents did not report finding any security tapes from the federal building itself.

The FBI in the past refused to release the security camera recordings, leading Trentadue and others to contend the government was hiding evidence that others were involved in the attack.

"It's taken a lawsuit and years to get the tapes," Trentadue said.
He received the latest batch of tapes over the summer in response to an April request for video from security cameras in 11 different locations. Nothing on the tapes was unexpected.

"The more important thing they show is what they don't show," Trentadue said. "These cameras would have shown the various roads and approaches to the Murrah Building."

Trentadue began looking into the bombing after his brother, Kenneth Trentadue, died at the Oklahoma City Federal Transfer Center in August 1995. Kenneth Trentadue was a convicted bank robber who was held at the federal prison after being picked up as a parole violator at his home in San Diego in June 1995.

He was never a bombing suspect, but Jesse Trentadue alleges guards mistook his brother for one and beat him to death during an interrogation. The official cause of Kenneth Trentadue's death is listed as suicide, but his body had 41 wounds and bruises that Jesse Trentadue believes could have come only from a beating.

A judge in 2001 awarded Kenneth Trentadue's family $1.1 million for extreme emotional distress in the government's handling of his death.

Jesse Trentadue said he has received about 30 security tapes, including some images that were used as evidence at bomber Timothy McVeigh's trial. McVeigh was convicted on federal murder and conspiracy charges and executed in 2001. Coconspirator Terry Nichols is serving life in prison on federal and state bombing convictions.

Trentadue said he is seeking more tapes along with a variety of bombing-related documents from the FBI and the CIA. An FOIA request by Trentadue for 26 CIA documents was rejected in June. A letter from the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency, which reviewed the documents, said their release "could cause grave damage to our national security."

Trentadue said he gave the latest set of tapes to The Oklahoman because of their historical value. The newspaper has agreed to provide copies to the Oklahoma City National Memorial & Museum.

[American Patriot]

I've ALWAYS believed others were involved.

Look at the idiots that did the bombing... "White Supremacists"? McVey and Nichols certainly were part of the group of idiots like Alex Jones (Jew Haters). Who else hates Jews? Oh... Muslims right? Right.

What did some of the pictures look like of possible suspects? I'll leave that to others to determine but I'm betting we will NEVER KNOW. McVey and Nichols might have planted the bomb, but they didn't have all the resources, or training to create the bombs. They didn't have the reason to do it. They had help, and that help supplied them with the money.

Don't believe that? Let me ask you a stupid question then... IF you deposit $5,000 bucks into a bank account tell me what happens next? It GETS REPORTED to the FBI!

Why IS that? How much do you think it cost McVey to put together his truck bomb? Why is 5K or more reportable?

[zenbudda]

"could cause grave damage to our national security."

I've always been curious as to what this means exactly. Would it be too far fetched to propose that exposing a connection between a US government offical (political or military) or businessman and would be a breach in national security? Or would it be because a government agent would be exposed by the requested information? of course my question is requesting a black and white answer and the answer may not be black and white. i'm just curious what "threat to national security" encompasss. heh, the funny part is I'm not sure how someone could answer this question without breaching national security.

[American Patriot]

I've always been curious as to what this means exactly. Would it be too far fetched to propose that exposing a connection between a US government offical (political or military) or businessman and would be a breach in national security? Or would it be because a government agent would be exposed by the requested information? of course my question is requesting a black and white answer and the answer may not be black and white. i'm just curious what "threat to national security" encompasss. heh, the funny part is I'm not sure how someone could answer this question without breaching national security.

Means "It's Classified".

[zenbudda]

so let's say that some camera near the bombing site had a clear video of a "top agent's" car. license plate and all. is it "possible" that this footage would be blacked out to protect that agent's identify in the name of national security? guess i'm trying to get a grasp on what the possibilities are of national security. ex-wife was an intel officer for the air force. when her subordinates would get drunk they would "talk" about a few things. but she herself was very secretive (about a lot of things...hence "ex wife") anyway, this type of stuff has always intrigued me.

[American Patriot]

No. Not necessarily.

Instead of me attempting to explain this... read the stuff below:

National security refers to the requirement to maintain the survival of the nation-state through the use of economic, military and political power and the exercise of diplomacy.

Now, go to the link below. I've excerpted some of it below the link.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classified_information

Classification levels

Although the classification systems vary from country to country, most have levels corresponding to the following British definitions (from the highest level to lowest):
Top Secret (TS)

The highest level of classification of material on a national level. Such material would cause "exceptionally grave damage" to national security if publicly available.

Secret
Such material would cause "grave damage" to national security if publicly available.

Confidential
Such material would cause "damage" or be "prejudicial" to national security if publicly available.

Restricted
Such material would cause "undesirable effects" if publicly available. Some countries do not have such a classification.

Unclassified
Technically not a classification level, but is used for government documents that do not have a classification listed above. Such documents can sometimes be viewed by those without security clearance.

[Backstop]

ex-wife was an intel officer for the air force. when her subordinates would get drunk they would "talk" about a few things.

They should've been fired and punished.

"Fired" as in had their clearance removed/dropped/etc.

"Punished" as in court martialed.

[American Patriot]

They should've been fired and punished.

"Fired" as in had their clearance removed/dropped/etc.

"Punished" as in court martialed.

No comment.