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Thread: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

  1. #21
    Super Moderator Malsua's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    >> This week, Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador has declared himself president,<<

    If you can't get the votes, just seize power.

    The hail thing is funny though
    -Mal

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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Funny perhaps, but HAIL MARY, get out the rosary or psalter. He's still at it- the electoral comision decided to count 11/130- about 8.4 % of the votes- It's not clear yet what % of those are pan,and which prd requested for recount... I imagine his "huddled masses" will dwindle with another big storm. The article sez they're willing to give their lives for this cause- but I'll bet a lot of hail will send them home.

    Here's the Yahoo English article
    http://mx.news.yahoo.com/

    canto XXV Dante

    from purgatory, the lustful... "open your breast to the truth which follows and know that as soon as the articulations in the brain are perfected in the embryo, the first Mover turns to it, happy...."
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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Showdown Is Looming In Streets Of Mexico
    A showdown looms in the streets today after a tribunal of federal judges ruled against a charismatic populist who lost a presidential election cliffhanger but inspires thousands of supporters camping in a downtown tent city that stretches for miles.

    With tensions already elevated by weeks of marches and blockades, Mexicans braced for what may come this morning when Andrés Manuel López Obrador is to announce how civil resistance to the election results will intensify.

    López Obrador rejected the tribunal's decision Saturday for a partial recount, rather than a full one, of the closest election in Mexico history.

    Speaking to supporters who endured a driving rain, López Obrador said he would fight.

    "To make it very clear, we are going to continue with our peaceful resistance," he said.

    He appealed to followers to be on guard.

    "We have to be careful not to be provoked, because what we are doing has to bring results by order and discipline," he said. "We have to respect everyone and their rights, so that all of our suffering will not be in vain."

    Looking out over the crowd, he measured their will.

    "Should we go or stay?" he asked.

    "We stay!" thousands shouted back in unison.

    Predictions vary widely as to what will come next — from blocking more downtown streets to taking over highways or the city's airport, where riot police with shields and helmets are lined up. Protection already has been stepped up at Mexico's presidential compound.

    Some people fear if the envelope is pushed, it could trigger a clash with federal troops.

    "Every Mexican is asking, what else is going to happen?" merchant Samuel Uglade, 72, said as he stood in the front of his fabric store around the corner from the square, which has become a tent city.

    Nobody expects López Obrador to throw in the towel.

    He has said he'll accept no less than a total recount of the July 2 election, which he contends was stolen by fraud.

    But the seven-member Federal Electoral Tribunal agreed unanimously to recount ballots in 9 percent of the more than 130,000 voting precincts.

    So far, López Obrador's supporters have been just an irritant, as they've used protracted public demonstrations to disrupt tourism and financial districts. There has been no violence or arrests.

    President Vicente Fox has appealed for a peaceful solution to the crisis and said he won't deploy federal troops unless asked by local authorities.

    That's not likely to happen, as the Mexico City government is run by López Obrador's Democratic Revolution Party and has supported the demonstrators at every turn.

    Mexico's Federal Electoral Institute has conservative Felipe Calderón, of the ruling National Action party, beating López Obrador by 244,000 votes out of nearly 42 million.

    "We accept the decision unconditionally," Calderón spokesman César Nava said.

    López Obrador contends the election was fraught with irregularities and that Calderón becoming the next president on Dec. 1 would amount to an electoral coup d'etat.

    Judges disagreed.

    Defending procedures set up a decade ago to end Mexico's institutionalized tradition of vote fraud, tribunal president Leonel Castillo said the system's checks and balances safeguard elections.

    While there almost will certainly be mistakes, Castillo said, the system itself is beyond reproach.

    The tribunal has until Sept. 6 to declare a winner in the election or annul it and call for another. There's no appeal.

    If the partial audit turns up widespread irregularities or dramatically narrows Calderón's lead, the tribunal could call for a fuller recount.

    Castillo's language suggests that is not likely, said John Ackerman, an expert on electoral law at the National Autonomous University.

    "They are sending a very broad signal that they are not going to take a very broad look at the conditions of the election," he said. "Actually, they are trying as hard as they can not to have a full recount."

    How far López Obrador's supporters will go is unknown. Some fear things could get nasty.

    Emilio Serrano, a federal congressman from López Obrador's party, outlined a path of peaceful resistance, even if it hurts.

    "We are prepared to give our lives for democracy in Mexico," he shouted through a megaphone to the crowd gathered outside the tribunal. "We are willing to let our blood flow."

    He said they would stand their ground.

    "We are not going to kill Mexicans, nor are we going to fight the army with bullets," he said. "We won't answer the aggression, but we will allow them to attack us and let our blood flow if necessary."

    Word of the ruling had only begun to filter into the city's central plaza by mid afternoon.

    Few of the thousands of López Obrador supporters, who have been camped there as part of a protest, seemed concerned.

    As they awaited instructions from their leader, they passed the time dancing, eating, playing, gossiping or just walking around.

    "Dancing against fraud," an announcer shouted to the crowd as a contest began to see who supposedly would later perform for López Obrador.

    Smells of cooking food mingled with wet clothes, unwashed bodies and incense.

    "We know they are going to use the army to try and kick us out, but there are more of us, so we will resist," said José Agapito, 54, a medical doctor carrying his 4-year-old granddaughter on his shoulders.

    "There is a difference between resisting fraud and resisting soldiers," he said. "If the army comes, it will be ugly."

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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Hi to all again. This situation seems to be getting out of control. Now with the partial recount, Lopez Obrador announced today that there will be a broader resistance action throughout the whole country, and that we've seen nothing yet. We're gonna need a heck of a hail storm to stop this people. Until now everything has been "peaceful" just a few incidents where a body was found in one of the plantones(camps) in the streets of Mexico City (a man, who apparently died of a heart attack), and another one where a woman was molested near one of these camps. It really makes you feel useless that you can't do anything but see these lazy people who want nothing out of life but eat their daily ration of food and keep on breathing. And for that they take whatever Obrador's people give them so they'll do all this stuff. I bet if this breaks down to a real fight, 60-70% of their apparent supporters won't risk their hide for a can of beans or 500 pesos. God I which I could do something. At least here in our state nobody gives a crap about that Obrador guy. All I hear whenever he speaks is Joseph Goebbels' propaganda tactics: "repeat a lie often enough and people will believe it". Add to that "repeat it enough to poor and ignorant people and it works faster"

    What's most infuriating its that most of his supporters are students that'll talk you down citing all these marxist thinkers, who just made the world a little worst by being born. One action Felipe Calderón should do when he first takes office should be passing some reforms on the UNAM(National Autonomous University) to get all the filth out. A real commie cespool in there...

    Well that's my two cents for now. I can't really discuss this subject cause I get really angry.

  5. #25
    Senior Member samizdat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Don't worry- he's a handsome dirtball, cross between che, benito Juarez. A loser. 50 pesos sez the russkies will cut off his drug money, and the po folk will go home. Jailbait.

    canto XXV Dante

    from purgatory, the lustful... "open your breast to the truth which follows and know that as soon as the articulations in the brain are perfected in the embryo, the first Mover turns to it, happy...."
    Shema Israel

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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    We’re all pulling for you Mexican patriots Monterey!

    I heard that there was also a 5.3 earthquake that hit Mexico City. I wonder if between the hail and earthquake that AMLO has gotten the message from The Big Guy Upstairs yet. What else does he need? A swarm of locusts?

    And in the news…

    Mexico Leftists Shut Foreign Banks In Protest
    Protesters blocked access to foreign banks in Mexico on Wednesday to protest what they said was election fraud while judges and troops oversaw a partial recount that could decide last month's presidential vote.

    Supporters of leftist Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador surrounded main offices in Mexico City of the U.S.-based Citigroup's Mexican unit Banamex, Bancomer bank owned by Spain's BBVA and the British giant HSBC. They closed them down for several hours, unfurling banners and chanting slogans.

    Lopez Obrador, a fiery anti-poverty campaigner, narrowly lost the July 2 presidential vote to conservative ruling party candidate Felipe Calderon.

    He says many votes for him went untallied while others were stolen from ballot boxes, and is demanding a recount of all 41 million votes.

    Guarded by soldiers, election officials began a recount of votes from 9 percent of polling stations.

    Lopez Obrador's followers have crippled downtown Mexico City for the past 10 days by setting up tents on the main Reforma boulevard running through the business district.

    All but one of Mexico's major banks are in the hands of foreign companies and the industry's sell-off has been a symbol of the free market reforms in Mexico disliked by the left.

    "It's them who are screwing the nation!" protesters chanted outside the HSBC building, a shiny new skyscraper on Reforma, as dozens of riot police stood guard.

    "We're defending the homeland, not the presidency. The homeland is in danger," said Eugenia Rodriguez, 63, a retired teacher from rural San Luis Potosi state.

    The protests had a nationalist tinge. Demonstrators draped a banner in Mexico's red, white and green colors over the front entrance to a large Banamex office in the Spanish colonial center of the capital.

    "Banamex is really Citigroup, a foreign bank that ransacks the country," said Gerardo Fernandez, spokesman for the leftist Party of the Democratic Revolution, or PRD.

    During the presidential campaign, Lopez Obrador promised to reopen the books on the government's controversial $100 billion bailout of struggling private banks during an economic crisis in the mid-1990s.

    Painfully Slow Recount

    Judges, election officials and party representatives will spend up to five days checking some four million votes at 11,839 voting stations.

    One recount at a center in Mexico City was painfully slow, with PRD representatives asking court actuaries to note every detail of proceedings.

    It took about an hour to tally a few hundred votes in front of a judge. A leftist official videotaped the recount.

    In the first few hours of the recount, officials detected serious irregularities in at least 15 of the 149 electoral districts being checked, said senior PRD figure Ricardo Monreal.

    Calderon's campaign and electoral court officials did not confirm that.

    If the partial recounts show Lopez Obrador closing the gap on Calderon, they could force the electoral court to open more ballot boxes. If there is no big change in the numbers, Lopez Obrador will come under heavy pressure to give up his fight.

    Many fear the power struggle could turn violent, posing the biggest challenge to Mexican democracy since President Vicente Fox won power in 2000 and ended seven decades of one-party rule infamous for corruption and fraudulent elections.

    Despite fiery rhetoric and growing tension, there has been no violence at any of the protests and Lopez Obrador insists his campaign will remain peaceful.

    Calderon's margin of victory was about 244,000 votes, or just 0.58 percentage points, but he insists it was clean. European Union observers have said there was no major fraud.

    The government has tightened Fox's personal security this week and also sent federal police to protect oil installations and the capital's international airport.

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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Protesters in Mexico Hold 4 Hostage After Fatal Shooting
    OAXACA, Mexico — Protesters were holding four people hostage Friday, accusing them of participating in the fatal shooting of a demonstrator the night before in this historic state capital reeling from escalating political violence.

    Also Friday, authorities arrested a top teachers' union leader believed to be the driving force behind the demonstrations that have besieged the city of Oaxaca since June in a bid to oust the Oaxaca state governor.

    The U.S. Embassy, meanwhile, warned U.S. citizens to steer clear of the protests, citing the possibility of further violence in the city popular with tourists for its cobbled streets, markets and cuisine.

    Protest organizer Enrique Rueda Pacheco told The Associated Press that police detained teachers' union leader Erangelio Mendoza Gonzalez on federal charges of blocking public access and taking over city buses. Federal authorities confirmed the arrest but did not provide details.

    Meanwhile, state spokesman Miguel Angel Concha Viloria said demonstrators were holding four people at a local TV station they have seized.

    The protesters accused the four of involvement in the killing of 50-year-old mechanic Jose Jimenez, who was shot in the heart late Thursday during a march of 8,000 people calling for the resignation of Oaxaca state Gov. Ulises Ruiz.

    The leftist Oaxaca People's Assembly, which organized the march, alleged Ruiz was behind the shooting — a charge denied by officials in the governor's office. The assembly is demanding Ruiz resign, accusing him of using force to repress dissent and rigging the 2004 election to win office.

    Ruiz on Friday condemned the violence. The governor is a member of the Institutional Revolutionary Party, or PRI, which ruled Mexico for 71 years until President Vicente Fox's election in 2000.

    In recent weeks, protesters have captured several men accused of attacking demonstrators and handed to them over to federal investigators.

    The slain protester's wife, Clara Jimenez, said the gunfire appeared to come from a house that the marchers passed.

    State prosecutor Lizbeth Cana said initial investigations revealed the protester had argued with the owners of the house after urinating in their yard. After the shooting, protesters set fire to the house.

    Cana also showed reporters a video showing Dr. Soledad Angela Rivera Torres, who says she owned the burned house and owns a medical clinic opposite it where the Jimenez's body was taken. Rivera tearfully said the four people taken hostage were her father, grandmother, and two brothers.

    She said the four had gone out to the street during the commotion and were seized and beaten by masked assembly members, who accused them of being behind the shooting. The protesters later burned the family's cars and clinic vehicles, she said.

    "They told us because we have a lot of money, we deserved what was happening to us," she said.

    About 80 teachers and other demonstrators paid homage to Jose Jimenez outside the clinic on Friday, singing "We shall overcome." About 300 protesters held a funeral ceremony for him later in the central square, draping a Mexican flag over his coffin.

    In other parts of the city, masked demonstrators armed with sticks and machetes commandeered city buses after ordering passengers off.

    The U.S. Embassy in Mexico City on Friday issued a warning advising U.S. citizens not to go near demonstrations in Oaxaca.

    "The possibility for violence continues and the situation remains tense," the embassy warning said. "Vandalism, arrests, and injuries continue to result from the ongoing confrontations."

    Protesters have commandeered 35 buses since sustained protests broke out in Oaxaca in June, after police attacked teachers striking for a pay raise.

    More than 2,000 protesters have camped out in the city center, building barricades, smashing windows and stealing government vehicles. Armed assailants have shot at a radio station and a newspaper that support the protests, injuring one reporter. Police are nowhere to be seen in the downtown.

    On Wednesday, two men and a 12-year-old boy headed to join the camps were shot dead on a road about 150 miles from the city, but it was unclear if that killing was connected to the protests.

    Mexico's most famous living painter, Franciso Toledo, who lives in Oaxaca, said he would close three cultural centers for fears protesters could break in and damage the artwork.

    Business groups say the conflict has caused losses of more than $50 million.

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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Mexico Judges Indicate Outcome of Election Won't Change
    MEXICO CITY — Mexico's top electoral judges suggested Monday that the 375 challenges to the July 2 election won't reverse the outcome — indicating that Felipe Calderon will likely be Mexico's next president.

    But the seven judges adjourned their session without making public their final ruling. They have until Sept. 6 to declare a president-elect or annul the election.

    Several of the judges defended their work in an open session Monday as dozens of protesters pressed against the courthouse gates, demanding that the election be given to leftist Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador despite a 244,000 vote advantage for the ruling party's Calderon.

    "Tolerance, the ability to listen, has prevailed over everything else," chief justice Leonel Castillo said.

    He praised court officials, saying some had worked 20-hour days to review huge stacks of evidence submitted by both leading parties. All of the challenges are now resolved, the court said.

    But the judges refused to summarize their findings. Many had also assumed the court would release the results of the partial recount it ordered on Aug. 5. Instead, judges who divided the challenged districts among themselves, each spoke about their individual findings, none of which appeared to significantly alter the outcome.

    Magistrate Alfonsina Berta Navarro said her part of the review — 25 of the 149 districts — showed the leftists dropping further behind: the ruling National Action Party lost 15,825 votes and Lopez Obrador's coalition lost 16,469.

    And Judge Jose Luna said that in his districts, all parties lost votes — more than 19,000 in all — but the percentages remained largely unchanged.

    "All the parties lost a considerable amount of votes but that did not affect the results," he said.

    The judges repeatedly said they could annul votes only when it wasn't clear which party the voter was supporting, saying each challenge had to be specific and backed up by evidence.

    "You can't just say: 'Well, there were irregularities,"' Castillo said, an apparent jab at Lopez Obrador's strategy of criticizing the electoral process generally and demanding a complete recount. The judges rejected that plea on Aug. 5, saying it was unnecessary and even illegal.

    Lopez Obrador claims fraud gave Calderon the edge of less than 0.6 percent. He has led street demonstrations and set up protest camps that have snarled traffic. He said Sunday he would ask his supporters during a rally on Sept. 16 — Mexico's Independence Day — whether he should declare himself the "alternative" president-elect.

    The former Mexico City mayor seems to have little hope the court will rule in his favor. On Monday, his party's spokesman, Gerardo Fernandez, told hundreds manning protest camps in Mexico City's Zocalo plaza: "It's clear the tribunal isn't up to the task. It's preparing to impose the right's candidate."

    But some of Lopez Obrador's supporters were still optimistic.

    "I believe they will give a good ruling, a ruling in favor of the people," said Elvia Araujo, a health clinic volunteer from the neighboring state of Mexico.

    President Vicente Fox leaves office Dec. 1, like all Mexican presidents limited to a single, six-year term.

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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Looks like AMLO wants to drive Mexico into civil war.

    Mexico Leftist To Create Parallel Government
    MEXICO CITY - Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador, convinced he won't be awarded the presidency, has vowed to create a parallel leftist government and is urging Mexicans not to recognize the apparent victory of the ruling party's Felipe Calderon.

    While his party lacks the seats in Congress to block legislation, Lopez Obrador can mobilize millions to pressure his conservative rival to adopt the left's agenda — or to clamp down and risk a backlash.

    Both scenarios are possibilities as the former Mexico City mayor lays out plans to create his own government to rule from the streets, with the support of thousands who are already occupying protest camps throughout downtown Mexico City.

    Some predict his parallel initiative — which Lopez Obrador's supporters call the "legitimate government" — could turn those protest camps into the core of a violent revolt, especially if the government tries to shut it down.

    Such violence broke out in the southern city of Oaxaca after Gov. Ulises Ruiz sent police to evict striking teachers. Outraged citizens' groups joined the protests, setting fire to buildings and public buses, seizing radio and TV stations and forcing the closure of businesses in a city known throughout the world as a quaint tourist destination.

    "Everything we do, from property taxes to permits to natural resources, will go through the 'legitimate government,'" said Severina Martinez, a school teacher from Oaxaca camped out in a tent in Mexico City's main Zocalo plaza. "We won't have anything to do with the official government."

    Some supporters took out a newspaper ad Tuesday, calling on Lopez Obrador to set up his own treasury department and said all Mexicans "should channel federal revenues to the new treasury department."

    Lopez Obrador is encouraging his followers to disobey Calderon, whose 240,000-vote advantage was confirmed Monday by the country's top electoral court. The seven magistrates stopped short of declaring Calderon president-elect, but they have only a week to declare a winner or annul the election.

    "We do not recognize Felipe Calderon as president, nor any officials he appoints, nor any acts carried out by his de-facto government," Lopez Obrador said after the court ruling, which he claims overlooked evidence of fraud in the July 2 elections.

    Lopez Obrador's Democratic Revolution Party, or PRD, increased its number of congressional seats in those elections and became the second-largest bloc, behind Calderon's National Action Party, on Tuesday as new lawmakers were sworn in.

    But it holds only a quarter of the seats — not enough to block legislation, especially if Calderon forges a likely alliance with the former ruling Institutional Revolutionary Party. That alliance would hold a majority in each house of Congress.

    Lopez Obrador has ruled out negotiations with what he calls the "spurious" and "imposed" government. Because PRD legislators fear crossing him or his fervent followers, they can't cut deals to get their own legislation approved, making them even weaker.

    "There is no possibility that we federal legislators in Congress will start any dialogue with the government," said PRD Senate leader Carlos Navarette, considered one of the party's moderates. "We will never forget that the leader and director of the Mexican people's action and the left is Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador."

    Lopez Obrador's plan is to have his government help the poor, oppose privatizations and make the news media — which he has accused of ignoring him — more "truthful and objective."

    It's not clear how he plans to do that, but his supporters are already planning to hold an alternative swearing in ceremony to rival the official inauguration on Dec. 1.

    People close to Lopez Obrador say he is assuming the role of his hero, 18th century President Benito Juarez, who led a roving, "unofficial" presidency from 1863 to 1867 during the French invasion, before driving out the invaders and executing the French-installed Emperor Maximilian.

    "Juarez ran the government from a carriage and restored the republic," said Rosario Ibarra, a human rights activist who frequently shares the stage with Lopez Obrador at his rallies. "We just hope there won't be any need to shoot anyone."

    So far, protesters have only scuffled with police. Some fear the movement could turn violent, although Lopez Obrador says it will remain peaceful.

    The administration of President Vicente Fox hopes it will all just boil down to some fiery rhetoric and posturing.

    "We think this is a symbolic, political act that has no validity in the affairs of state," Fox's spokesman, Ruben Aguilar, said Tuesday. Asked about Lopez Obrador's plan to declare himself head of state, Aguilar noted that "in this country, everyone is free to say whatever they want."

    There is no question that Lopez Obrador is taking his "legitimate government" or "government in resistance" — the exact title has yet to be determined — very seriously.

    Asked whether Lopez Obrador would wear some version of the presidential sash during his swearing-in ceremony, PRD spokesman Gerardo Fernandez accused reporters of poking fun at the candidate. He also upbraided those who spoke of plans for an "alternative government."

    "What Andres Manuel has suggested is not an alternative president," Fernandez said. "It will be a legitimate government with a legitimate president."

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    Senior Member samizdat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Handsome hero, trying to pave the way for Hugo. Somewhat of a problem- a wake up call for Mexico- they couldn't jail Marcos- now this- Carter and Clinton sleep with commies. So AMLO sleeps in a big park. He'll be ignored, and very pesty- can't water hose millions or 20-30% of angry Mexicans. He's a symbol for anarchy.
    "in this country, everyone is free to say whatever they want."

    canto XXV Dante

    from purgatory, the lustful... "open your breast to the truth which follows and know that as soon as the articulations in the brain are perfected in the embryo, the first Mover turns to it, happy...."
    Shema Israel

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    Senior Member samizdat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    FYI... I'll later check an independant weather source, but a taxi driver who watches TV informed me that hail is falling day and night on AMLO. I believe taxi drivers.
    Good sign. I lived in DF for nine months. These hailstones are not pellets- not quite snowballs, but half a fist.

    canto XXV Dante

    from purgatory, the lustful... "open your breast to the truth which follows and know that as soon as the articulations in the brain are perfected in the embryo, the first Mover turns to it, happy...."
    Shema Israel

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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    According to yahoo...hailed Sunday in mex city. Two photos below from late August storms.




    http://mx.news.yahoo.com/foto/060902/38/1vc8o.html

    canto XXV Dante

    from purgatory, the lustful... "open your breast to the truth which follows and know that as soon as the articulations in the brain are perfected in the embryo, the first Mover turns to it, happy...."
    Shema Israel

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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Both Sides Braced For Mexico Violence
    Both men are in their mid-30s, and say that they believe they are defending democracy and that they are ready for a violent clash today, if that is what is necessary.

    Yet they could hardly be more different.

    One is a buffed federal policeman and country boy who sports a buzz cut.

    The other is a shaggy-haired, city-slicker leftist who demands Mexico change.

    Should they face off along a barrier to protect President Vicente Fox as he gives his final state-of-the-nation address today, it won't be a fair fight.

    The officer — one of the many nicknamed Robocops for the 1987 movie about a cop outfitted with state of the art technology — has a helmet, shield, body armor and other goodies issued by the government.

    "We're defending the nation," said the officer, who gave his name as Javier. "We won't be provoked."

    In the past, people have tried to draw the Robocops into action by hitting them with bottles, burning them with Molotov cocktails or soaking them with bucketfuls of feces.

    The cops have been accused of crossing the line by beating people mercilessly and tearing apart private property.

    The activist — one of many who have filled the streets in support of populist Andrés Manuel López Obrador — has shin and forearm guards he bought at a sporting-goods store. They're still in the bag.

    The stage is set for Fox to defend his legacy and present his administration's accomplishments during a speech, to be televised live from a besieged congressional compound in the heart of Mexico City.

    "I will be there," vowed Manuel Zuñiga, the López Obrador supporter with the sports gear.

    He said that while he's ready to fight, if there's any violence, it will be because the police draw first blood.

    He offered a caution for the thousands of police who have been deployed to stand guard behind welded 12-foot steel walls: "Don't go against the people."

    Nobody knows what will happen.

    There's strong talk that Fox may avoid trouble in the streets and rowdiness within Congress by passing on the speech entirely, and simply handing the text to Congress.

    At a minimum, he's expected to avoid subjecting his motorcade to peril by arriving in a helicopter.

    It appeared the government is not taking chances. For weeks, an army of federal police wearing riot gear has stood behind the 12-foot-high steel wall protecting the compound.

    There also were water cannons mounted on trucks.

    Roads were blocked and officials announced late Thursday that most subway stations in the area, as well as near the presidential compound, would be closed — a quick way to ensure that if demonstrators want to get anywhere near Congress, they're going to have to walk for miles.

    López Obrador has established a miles-long tent city in the business and tourist districts to protest a July 2 election he lost to Fox's former energy minister, Felipe Calderón.

    López Obrador and members of his Democratic Revolution Party, known as the PRD, say the election was a fraud.

    The demonstrators already have wreaked traffic chaos on this city and last clashed with police in early August, when they tried to establish an encampment outside Congress.

    Tear gas was launched and bottles were thrown. As many as a dozen people were injured, resulting in a beefed up, edgy law-enforcement presence.

    Mexico City-based analyst Joy Langston said these are difficult times, with police and activists expected to square off multiple times this month.

    "My dearest hope is there will be no armed violence, but there could be some heads knocked together," she said, adding that crowds will try to taunt police into violence. "The worst thing that could happen is that people be shot."

    She predicted there could broken noses and shouting today, but that the odds are against any deaths.

    López Obrador has said his movement is one of peaceful, civil resistance.

    At the same time, he has branded Fox a "traitor of democracy" and said neither he nor Calderón deserves to lead.

    PRD leader Leonel Cota reiterated that his party's congressional delegates won't just interrupt, but will stop Fox from delivering his address.

    He won't say what they will do, but in the past, opposition party members have chanted, jeered, waved signs and turned their backs on Fox.

    "The president moved against our movement, and our movement will not respond," he said as he headed into a meeting to discuss what actions to take.

    Outside Congress, federal riot police were standing guard. They'd been living on the grounds for weeks, working in shifts, and expected to be away from their families for about a month.

    When asked how he feels when people refer to him as an infamous Robocop, the officer named Javier smiled and offered a simple response: "I feel beautiful."

  14. #34
    Senior Member samizdat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call


    much better photo here_
    http://www.notiver.com.mx/upload/ima...57539566.pjpeg

    I wonder who controls this poor angry soul? What a pity if he is destined for Trotsky's fate. Rather he wander through the hail, searching shelter for his huddled mess. He looks a bit worried. His potential fate could bring plenty of hate.

    canto XXV Dante

    from purgatory, the lustful... "open your breast to the truth which follows and know that as soon as the articulations in the brain are perfected in the embryo, the first Mover turns to it, happy...."
    Shema Israel

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  15. #35
    Creepy Ass Cracka & Site Owner Ryan Ruck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Not looking good…

    Political Chaos Rules In Oaxaca
    OAXACA, Mexico - This is a city on the edge of anarchy.

    Militants with clubs roam Oaxaca, raiding government offices and dragging out employees who refuse to leave. Barricades and torched vehicles block the streets. Captured radio stations broadcast leftist manifestos day and night. Police have fled the city, and the governor is in hiding. The once-beautiful downtown is covered with revolutionary graffiti. "Tourist, go home," one message warns.

    The anti-government rebellion raging in this city of 256,000 is the most serious in a series of protests that have rattled Mexico, fueled in part by a bitter July 2 presidential election. Officials are meeting today to try to work out a truce.

    "The government wants everyone to think that Mexico is progressing," Rosie López said as she guarded a barricade made of sheet metal and boulders. "But a lot of people still live in very bad conditions. We're not satisfied with the way this country is being run."

    The siege in Oaxaca, 210 miles southeast of Mexico City, began in May as a simple teachers strike but snowballed after Gov. UlÃÂ*ses RuÃÂ*z OrtÃÂ*z used tear gas and riot police against the demonstrators.

    Since then, dozens of leftist groups have rallied to the teachers' side and are demanding the governor resign. They have formed an umbrella group, the Popular Assembly of the People of Oaxaca, or APPO, and have seized control of the entire city.

    Seeds Of Conflict

    Oaxaca (pronounced wah-HA-kah) is the capital of a state with the same name. It's an impoverished, mountainous region peppered with tiny Indian villages. For centuries, people here and in other southern states like Chiapas and Guerrero have been the victims of racial discrimination and government neglect.

    The state's schools are run-down and badly equipped, and teachers earn only about $500 a month. Because the towns are so remote, many teachers spend weekdays at the schools and return to their families only on weekends, or sometimes every two weeks. For some, the commute involves an all-day hike along mountain trails.

    For several summers straight, the state's 70,000 teachers have demonstrated in the state capital to demand higher wages and better working conditions. This year, their main demand was an increase in the cost-of-living allowance.

    On May 22 union members began camping out in the capital's main plaza. As the protests began growing more rowdy, tourists started avoiding the city. Gov. RuÃÂ*z OrtÃÂ*z decided to take action.

    Before dawn on June 14, riot police fired tear gas into the plaza and began tearing down tents. The teachers fled down side streets.

    "It was terrifying," teacher Liboria MartÃÂ*nez said. "A lot of us had our children with us, and they were suffocating on the tear gas."

    Soon, the tide of the battle turned. Members of other labor unions flooded into the streets to attack the police with sticks and stones. Outnumbered, the police retreated.

    The conflict quickly became a rallying point for radical political parties, student activists and trade unionists. It also attracted local "people's organizations," groups that represent squatters, unauthorized street vendors, gypsy cabdrivers and other outlaws.

    City Under Siege

    Oaxaca now lives in a peculiar state of occupation. During the day, the few remaining tourists, mainly young European backpackers, browse through handicraft stalls. Just a few miles away, club-wielding militants from APPO's "mobile brigades" systematically invade government offices and drive out employees.

    On Thursday, one employee at the Civil Defense Secretariat resisted. The militants beat him, doused him with green ink, marched him down to the plaza and put him on display as a crowd jeered.

    The governor and Legislature are in hiding, reportedly moving among hotels and private homes on the outskirts of town.

    At night, the militants mount barricades all over the city. Earsplitting booms from signal rockets echo over the downtown all night. One boom means to be alert for government forces, two booms means imminent danger, three means a barricade is under attack.

    Petty crime has soared, especially at night, because police have fled the city. The militants have torched several police cars, along with more than a dozen city buses.

    Pro-government people, possibly plainclothes police, occasionally speed through the city in trucks, shooting at the militants. On Aug. 21 they opened fire on protesters guarding a television transmitter, killing one.

    There are fears that things could get much worse after guerrillas carrying AK-47 assault rifles briefly blocked a highway in Oaxaca last month. The federal government is now trying to mediate a truce. The negotiations resume today after a four-day break.

    "We cannot permit these scenes," presidential spokesman Rubén Aguilar said last week. "The violence, the brutality, and the loss of control of the players involved must be condemned."

    Nationwide Discontent

    Meanwhile, political strife and labor disputes elsewhere in Mexico have only fueled the unrest in Oaxaca.

    Like most of the poor states in southern Mexico, Oaxaca voted overwhelmingly for liberal candidate Andrés Manuel López Obrador in the July 2 presidential election. When conservative Felipe Calderón won by a razor-thin margin, López Obrador's supporters accused the government of massive voter fraud and blockaded a main avenue in Mexico City, wreaking havoc.

    The country was already shaken by a deadly clash between police and striking steel workers in Michoacán state in April and riots in the town of San Salvador Atenco in May.

    Some of the organizers in the Atenco riots are believed to be active in Oaxaca. And most of the groups protesting in Oaxaca supported López Obrador. The clashes and demonstrations have exposed simmering discontent in Mexico, especially in the poor south. About 40 percent of the country still lives beneath the poverty line, and wages have not risen much despite six years of relative economic stability.

    President Vicente Fox has been slow to intervene in the demonstrations, partly to avoid allegations of oppression during the election controversy. "The current president is afraid to use force to establish order," said Andrés Avelino Soriano, president of the Business Union of Oaxaca. "He is a person of very weak character . . . and he has an erroneous idea of what democracy is."

    Last week, Mexico's Interior Ministry began mediating talks between APPO and the state government. There has been little progress.

    Many Oaxacans are fed up with the demonstrators but say they are equally disgusted with the federal government for years of neglect.

    "Fox doesn't care about Oaxaca because there are no factories here. It's too poor," said Juan Carlos Sandoval, a bathroom attendant at the November 20 Public Market.

    "If this were Guadalajara, this would have been over months ago," he said. "In fact, it probably would have never begun."

  16. #36
    Forum General Brian Baldwin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    We're about to get flooded with illegals. I can just see this now. We had better seal that damn border fast.
    Brian Baldwin

    Yea though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death I shall fear no evil.... For I am the meanest S.O.B. in the valley.


    "A simple way to take measure of a country is to look at how many want in... And how many want out." - Tony Blair on America



    It is the soldier, not the reporter, who has given us freedom of the press.

    It is the soldier, not the poet, who has given us freedom of speech.

    It is the soldier, not the campus organizer, who has given us the freedom to demonstrate.

    It is the soldier who salutes the flag, who serves beneath the flag, and whose coffin is draped by the flag, who allows the protester to burn the flag.

    -Father Denis O'Brien of the United States Marine Corp.


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  17. #37
    Senior Member Joey Bagadonuts's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Hiya BB,

    Yep I agree with ya...they're gonna be swarming over the border real soon. But ya know what President Bush is gonna do about that? Not a damn thing.
    The North American Union is what this is all about. We're having it forced down out throats whether we like it or not.


    ***
    ...that's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

  18. #38
    Forum General Brian Baldwin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mexico Election Too Close To Call

    Yeah Joey. I agree 100%. I've noticed of late that our government is quick at allowing our nation to be damaged. Iran, UN, Mexico, NK, and even the stupid French. Soon us Sunday Ticket Holders will be forced to watch Soccer. SOCCER!!!! It's not even a good sport. lol
    Brian Baldwin

    Yea though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death I shall fear no evil.... For I am the meanest S.O.B. in the valley.


    "A simple way to take measure of a country is to look at how many want in... And how many want out." - Tony Blair on America



    It is the soldier, not the reporter, who has given us freedom of the press.

    It is the soldier, not the poet, who has given us freedom of speech.

    It is the soldier, not the campus organizer, who has given us the freedom to demonstrate.

    It is the soldier who salutes the flag, who serves beneath the flag, and whose coffin is draped by the flag, who allows the protester to burn the flag.

    -Father Denis O'Brien of the United States Marine Corp.


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