2008 Presidential Elections

[American Patriot]

Well, here's the thread you've all been waiting for. Time to post various notes, debates and discussions about your favorite candidates.

Please use this thread for discussion, or timely news articles. This is about the elections in general and all the candidates as we come down to the Primaries.

Here's the guy I'm NOT voting for. Can you see why?

[American Patriot]

Last night's debate (R)

Posted: Monday, October 22, 2007 9:18 AM by Mark Murray
Categories: 2008, Republican debates

The Boston Globe’s lead: "The eight Republican candidates for president held a fiery debate last night filled with charges and confrontations about who is a true conservative and "real Republican" as they defended their stands on issues such as abortion, gay marriage, and taxes."


The Los Angeles Times headlines the Thompson-Giuliani skirmishes. And it adds, "With groans and cheers, more than 3,000 spectators in the convention hall punctuated the scrappy back-and-forth among the candidates."


The New York Times: “The debate stood out for the intensity and personal nature of the exchanges, as Republicans tried to distinguish themselves — a tactic that risked highlighting the unhappiness among conservatives with much of the field.”


USA Today adds that the GOP hopefuls “clashed Sunday over one of their party's most basic questions: Who is the most conservative? Rudy Giuliani, Mitt Romney and Mike Huckabee cited their conservative executive experience, while John McCain and Fred Thompson touted conservative Senate voting records — and all took shots at the presumed Democratic frontrunner.”


The Wall Street Journal: “Indeed, much of the debate was devoted to how the candidates would go about defeating Mrs. Clinton, a Democratic presidential candidate who currently holds a commanding lead in national and early voting state polls.”


The New York Post calls Clinton the “‘roast’ of the town.”

Fred Thompson stood out to the Politico's Martin: "Thompson, showing a degree of passion unseen in his first debate appearance two weeks ago, offered perhaps the toughest charges of the night."


The Des Moines Register’s David Yepsen writes, “McCain had the best night. Rudy Giuliani also turned in a good performance and newcomer Fred Thompson did much better than he did in his first gabfest.” The debate “was especially unlikely to have much impact in New Hampshire, which is big Red Sox territory and where most televisions probably weren’t tuned to politics Sunday night.”

And an interesting take on Ron Paul: “Paul isn’t likely to win any of the Republican primaries and caucuses but his message resonates with mainstream voters or Democrats who aren’t rank and file GOP activists. They laugh and hoot at his messages now but come November, if the GOP loses the White House, many Republicans will be saying they should have paid attention to what the man was saying about U.S. military policy, civil liberties and spending.”


So did Fox News win many Democratic friends last night by having a segment that allowed the GOP candidates to take cheap shot after cheap shot at Clinton? That said, the segment only seemed to further the impression of the inevitability of her campaign. As the New York Times pointed out: "This debate makes it official: It’s open season on Hillary Clinton… The amount of time devoted to Mrs. Clinton makes it clear that the Republicans both want her to be the Democratic nominee and think she will be the nominee."


NBC/NJ's Adam Aigner-Treworgy notes that in the post-debate, there were several converts in the crowd who were won over by Fred’s surprising energy. But there were plenty of others who were merely encouraged to “lean” in Thompson’s direction after a performance in which he showed more energy than ever before.

[American Patriot]

Oh, here's the other I won't be voting for.

[Luke]

So far this year I am still gathering information on Presidential candidates. It seems every election it is harder for me to decide who I feel would be the best person to lead our country. Jeez, I hope it is not that I am getting older!

So far I will not be voting for any of the Democratic candidates and damn few of the Republicans. I was impressed with what I hear from Mike Huckabee, but I fear political hype. What is it with Hope Arkansas, something in the water? His interview on the Glenn Beck show seemed to show him in an honest light.

I would not be opposed to voting for a female, or person of color, for the Office of The President, but as of yet there are no candidates I feel qualifed for the job. I think that people from my Dad's generation are still not ready for such a radical move, but I would not rule out voting for a candidate like that myself.

On this particular day and time I would vote for the candidate who I feel would....

1. Best protect our country against all enemies, forgeign and domestic...

2. To the best of their ability preserve, defend and protect the Constitution Of the United States of America

One of my concerns is far too much "popular media" attention. Overkill if you will. I relate this to my musical past. You hear something you like, listen to it 1000 times learning to perform it, then after you perform it 5 more times you are burned out, never want to hear it again. I hope that makes sense. Maybe it would be simpler to limit when politicians could start campaigning.

Looking forward to reading other opinions from this board, and by the way I won't be voting for the little box with the red x in it either.

My stepmother tells me that she has never voted because she doesn't think it would make any difference and she is afraid she would vote for the "wrong" candidate. I wonder how many other women from that era have similar feelings?

[Aplomb]

My stepmother tells me that she has never voted because she doesn't think it would make any difference and she is afraid she would vote for the "wrong" candidate. I wonder how many other women from that era have similar feelings?

It's just my opinion, but I think the same can be said from those who are poor, and from those who are black. Personally, being an "older" female, I think that many of us have voted in the past and not known what and who we were voting for because of two things. One being accepting the regular opinion and view of liberal news and the negative ads. The other being that there was no internet so investigation of issues and candidates was not so easy. All the same, we voted. I think most of us risked making a mistake to be able to make our voices heard. I do what I can to educate my children in the political realm, but it would be nice to see this added to public education, where all of the parties have some representative speak to classes in high school about their party views and so forth along with having pre-prepared questions in opposition for the students to ask the reps in order to get a good grasp of rhetoric and propaganda and to actively use some critical thinking skills. It would be nice to have first-time voters being informed and knowledgeable voters for a change instead of just being opinionated due to being fed biased liberal views by media and their educators, as I once was.

[Aplomb]

In fact, it would be more than "nice". It would change America in a drastic way for the good.

[American Patriot]

I'm going to be very blunt here.

1) America isn't ready for a woman as President. We're barely ready for one as Sec. of State. Look at the past Secretaries' of State, both under Clinton and currently. Condi Rice is an awesome lady. But, I MIGHT vote for her were she to run for President, however, she sucks as a Sec. of State.

2) I don't care about the color of a person. I do care about their agenda.

That brings me to this. When it comes to agendas, there is only ONE. The one that keeps America "American", and not Socialist, Communist or some other hateful scheming control freakish religion.

So ANY Republican will work for me

[American Patriot]

RON PAUL PASSES FRED THOMPSON IN NEW HAMPSHIRE
ALASKA REPORT ^ | 29 OCTOBER 2007 | ALASKA REPORT

Washington - Republican Texas congressman Ron Paul is in fourth place in a new poll among 2008 Republican candidates, Fred Thompson, who is estimated to be second-place in the national polls, is in sixth place.

From a Ron Paul press release: - St. Anselm College's Institute of Politics released a new presidential primary preference poll today that puts Republican Texas congressman, and supposed presidential "long shot", Ron Paul in fourth place among the 2008 Republican candidates with 7.4 percent. The survey of likely New Hampshire primary voters, finalized by SRBI Research in New York City, ranks Congressman Paul fourth behind Mitt Romney, Rudy Giuliani, and John McCain, respectively, and also shows that 40 percent of self-identified independents who may vote Republican, and 19 percent who will, are still undecided.

Fred Thompson, who is estimated to be second-place in the national polls, is in sixth place.

The new figure shows that Congressman Paul is gaining momentum in key primary states, up from the 5 percent Gallup Poll estimate on October 17. Recent poll results from public opinion service Rasmussen Reports indicate that number could be much higher nationwide.

"By all accounts, Dr. Paul's support is rising steadily," said Paul campaign chairman Kent Snyder. "Americans are ready for a change and his unifying message of freedom, peace and prosperity is bringing more people together every day."

1,514 likely New Hampshire primary voters were surveyed between October 25 and 21. St. Anselm College is a private Catholic liberal arts college in Manchester, New Hampshire.

[American Patriot]

here's the EXACT reason I told Osborne what I thought of Ron Paul before, and the rest of you too.

He's a kook. Period.

Ron Paul’s campaign paid conspiracy nut Alex Jones $1,300?
posted at 1:30 pm on October 27, 2007 by Allahpundit

You can thank Beth of MVRWC for digging this up. So it seems now we’ve got money moving in both directions between America’s Greatest Patriot and this bottom-feeding Truther jackass: a $2,300 donation from Jones to Paul and a $1,300 payment this quarter from Paul’s campaign to “Jones, Alex.” Assuming it’s the same Alex Jones, which seems a safe bet, pray tell what might that payment have been for? The likeliest explanation is that it’s some sort of service fee, either Jones doing something on behalf of the campaign or allowing the campaign to do something using his property. Either way, I’m mighty curious to know what special service might have been provided such that Paul’s people couldn’t have gone elsewhere and gotten the same deal from someone who isn’t a degenerate conspiracy theorist. There’s another question for the media to ask him during one of his myriad cable news appearances. Annnny day now.

Beth points out another curious payment, much less sinister than the one to Jones but also less explicable: a hefty $42,325.99 to Babyshere Inc. Paul is an OB/GYN by trade and passionately pro-life so I’m guessing they did some work together in that vein, but I can’t find anything on Google about it.

Update: People are commenting that this is much more of a smoking gun re: Paul’s coziness with Jones than the donation Jones sent to Paul. I completely disagree. I’m willing to give Paul a pass on the donation he apparently received from Stormfront founder Don Black (assuming he returns the money, of course) since it’s reasonable to believe Paul doesn’t know who Black is. He and his people certainly know who Jones is, though, so why not return the donation immediately? Answer: Because Paul has no problem associating with Jones, as we already know from his many appearances on Jones’s show. In that sense, this whole gotcha game with the money is idiotic. Paul’s willing guest shots on nutjob radio are enough to fatally taint his candidacy, not this penny-ante donation/payment business.

Update: The $1,300 payment is in fact a partial donation of Jones’s campaign contribution. More here.

[American Patriot]

And this:

Paul campaign’s “payment” to Alex Jones was a partial refund of his donation
posted at 1:38 pm on October 29, 2007 by Allahpundit
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Duly noted and duly corrected. You’ll find the disbursement here about three-quarters of the way down. I could have done without the insinuations of laziness (”bloggers can’t be bothered to do five minutes of research”), especially when bloggers are credited in the same post for having discovered the donation from Don Black — can the campaign “not be bothered” to police for that sort of thing, given their unsolicited yet rising support among white supremacists? — but kudos to Paul for returning, well, not quite all of Alex Jones’s filthy $2,300 but a good-sized chunk of it. The first step is always the hardest.

As for Paul’s relationship with Jones:

I fear that Paul isn’t about to denounce Jones, and it’s a shame. When Paul made his most recent appearance on Jones’s radio show, I asked the candidate’s spokesman why he continues to associate with Jones. I detected some quiet frustration in his answer that Paul had promised the interview and that he keeps his word in such matters. Considering that Jones’s entire operation exploits gullible people willing to believe anything about 9/11, he might want to consider making fewer such promises in the future.

Indeed. Or none at all, even. Between that, his fears of a new Gulf of Tonkin incident in the Persian Gulf to precipitate war with Iran, and his warnings about the plans for a North American Union (replete with new Amero currency), people might start to get it in their heads that he’s a crank.

To make amends, I offer the Paul campaign a bit of free advertising. Here’s New Hamphire ad number two, a vast improvement over New Hampshire ad number one.

Update: One other point from Freddoso’s post. What does this mean?

The “payment” to Jones (and yes, it is that same Jones) was not a payment at all, but a partial refund of Jones’s $2,300 contribution. It is clearly marked as such, if you look in the right place on the electronic FEC forms. Paul’s spokesman said he put a line in to the campaign treasurer when he noticed it being discussed on the blogosphere, but that’s the answer he’s going to get.

Does that mean he didn’t notice they’d received a contribution from Jones until he heard bloggers talking about it? Or that he didn’t notice that it might be a problem until he heard bloggers talking about it? I’m guessing the latter. If Paul had some strong objection of his own to Jones and his money, he wouldn’t be appearing on his radio show.

[American Patriot]

And this itty, bitty tidbit:

Did America’s Greatest Patriot get a $500 donation from Stormfront’s founder?

posted at 8:48 pm on October 25, 2007 by Allahpundit
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Phrased as a question because there’s no smoking-gun proof but submitted for your consideration because the circumstantial evidence is compelling. The guy who runs Stormfront is named Don Black; he appears to be based in Florida. As of 2001 he was married to David Duke’s ex-wife, Chloe. There’s a Chloe Duke listed at a certain address in Lakeland, Florida; a cross-check of that address in Ron Paul’s campaign finance records reveals a $500 donation from a “self-employed/website manager” named, you guessed it, Don Black. Might there be another Mr. and Mrs. Don and Chloe Black in the same state with similar professions who aren’t degenerate racists? There might. But since the media’s conspicuously uninterested in asking questions about the Patriot’s unsavory base, let’s see if we can’t push this onto their plate and at least force them into asking this one.


Ron Paul can’t be faulted for accepting the donation if he didn’t know who it was from, but now that he knows he’s got a sewer running into his coffers it’s time to disgorge and start taking a hard look at some of the other, less savory elements who are bankrolling him. For instance, how about a maxed-out donation from America’s most notorious conspiracy theorist?



Think he should give that back? Think he will?

[American Patriot]

Ok, who is REALLY your personal choice for candidate?

Let's do a survey and find out.

Go here, answer the questions HONESTLY and then submit the form.

http://www.wqad.com/Global/link.asp?L=259460

The following are my choices, in order:

Below are the candidates ranked by how much you agree with their stances.

	Fred Thompson Score: 52	Agree Iraq Immigration Taxes Stem-Cell Research Health Care Abortion Social Security Line-Item Veto Marriage Death Penalty	Disagree Energy
	Duncan Hunter Score: 52	Agree Iraq Immigration Taxes Stem-Cell Research Health Care Abortion Social Security Line-Item Veto Marriage Death Penalty	Disagree Energy
	Mitt Romney Score: 46	Agree Iraq Immigration Taxes Health Care Abortion Line-Item Veto Marriage Death Penalty	Disagree Stem-Cell Research Social Security Energy
	John McCain Score: 43	Agree Iraq Taxes Stem-Cell Research Health Care Abortion Social Security Line-Item Veto Energy Death Penalty	Disagree Immigration Marriage
	Ron Paul Score: 33	Agree Immigration Taxes Stem-Cell Research Health Care Abortion Social Security Energy	Disagree Iraq Line-Item Veto Marriage Death Penalty
	Tom Tancredo Score: 33	Agree Taxes Stem-Cell Research Health Care Abortion Social Security Line-Item Veto Marriage	Disagree Iraq Immigration Energy Death Penalty
	Mike Huckabee Score: 31 Video	Agree Stem-Cell Research Health Care Abortion Social Security Line-Item Veto Marriage Death Penalty	Disagree Iraq Immigration Taxes Energy
	Rudy Giuliani Score: 29	Agree Iraq Taxes Health Care Social Security Death Penalty	Disagree Immigration Stem-Cell Research Abortion Line-Item Veto Energy Marriage
	Joe Biden Score: 13	Agree Social Security Line-Item Veto Death Penalty	Disagree Iraq Immigration Taxes Stem-Cell Research Health Care Abortion Energy Marriage
	Bill Richardson Score: 10 Video	Agree Line-Item Veto Death Penalty	Disagree Iraq Immigration Taxes Stem-Cell Research Health Care Abortion Social Security Energy Marriage
	Barack Obama Score: 5 Video	Agree Death Penalty	Disagree Iraq Immigration Taxes Stem-Cell Research Health Care Abortion Social Security Line-Item Veto Energy Marriage
	John Edwards Score: 5 Video	Agree Death Penalty	Disagree Iraq Immigration Taxes Stem-Cell Research Health Care Abortion Social Security Line-Item Veto Energy Marriage
	Hillary Clinton Score: 5	Agree Death Penalty	Disagree Iraq Immigration Taxes Stem-Cell Research Health Care Abortion Social Security Line-Item Veto Energy Marriage

[American Patriot]

From this survey you can easily see why I believe that Thompson and Clinton will be the eventual nominees, and I think a Thompson/Hunter ticket would be awesome.

On the other hand, I heard some folks stumping for Dr. Bill Bennett to be placed on the VP ticket for most of the conservatives.

I think that would actually be a good idea too.

[American Patriot]

Something else that was very obvious to me is that there are some very right, and very left characters here, and Guilani is definitely a middle of the road fella.

[Ryan Ruck]

That's funny... I took that same quiz a few days ago and scored nearly the exact same results as you Rick! I too had Thompson and Hunter tied for 1st. And, I also agree. I think that if Hunter can't be Prez, he'd make a great VP and is young enough that he could then make a run for Prez at the end of a Fred Thompson administration.

[American Patriot]

hehehehe Ryan, you're young yet, you're getting the hang of this presidential stuff though. /snicker

[American Patriot]

Mitt Romney might be someone's idea of a good guy, but to me, he's an ass that isn't getting a vote from me, or a couple million others....

Romney "Disses" Amateur Radio In Televised Town Meeting
Posted on Wednesday 16 November 2005 @ 15:48:10 Governor Mitt Romney dismissed the role of Amateur Radio operators in emergency communications during a televised "town meeting" program last night on WCVB's "When Disaster Strikes: Segment Two." The program featured public safety and volunteer organization officials from across Massachusetts among its audience.

Host and moderator Natalie Jacobson asked an increasingly-agitated Governor Romney questions about communications interoperability, and communication without commercial power. Romney was next asked by Jacobson, "...so does it come down to ham radio?..."

The Governor replied in a disgusted tone, "No, we don't need to deal with ham radio operators..."

Embarrassed public safety officials later tried to put in a good word for Amateur Radio. National Weather Service Warning Coordination Meteorologist Glenn Field was prepared to state the importance of Amateur Radio, when Salvation Army Colonel Fred Van Brunt was called upon. Van Brunt remarked about his organization's quest to improve its communications capabilities and how Amateur Radio has aided his organization. "The ham radio situation helps a great deal," he stated.

"I have already written and submitted a letter to the Governor's Office," wrote Eastern MA Section Emergency Coordinator Rob Macedo, KD1CY. "I have also written an email to Natalie Jacobson."

ARRL Section Manager Mike Neilsen, W1MPN sent a section-wide email today to all Eastern MA ARRL members describing the incident along with actions he and his staff were taking to mitigate the situation.

"[Romney's] attitude about us sets an unfortunate tone within the state's executive branch," wrote Neilsen. "As a former military officer, I see this as a failure in leadership. My immediate concern is our working relationship within the [Massachusetts Emergency Management Team] environment." Neilsen intends to address the Governor's comments as "an urgent matter" at a meeting on November 17 with Don Carlton from the Massachusetts Emergency Management Agency.

"I was very disturbed about what the Governor stated on the program," wrote Ron Wood, W1PLW, the section's Public Information Coordinator. "It does show that more work is needed by all hams in the section. It's a great idea to write letters explaining the good we do." Wood is attempting to schedule a meeting with the Governor's office tomorrow so that EMA ARRL staffers might discuss the matter further.

Tom Kinahan, N1CPE wrote that Governor Romney's comment has made "a PR problem" for Kinahan in his role as MA State RACES Officer.

"I've got a roster of over 150 Amateur Radio operators that support local communities, and those of us that directly support the state government. There are at least double that in terms of people that are actually out there that I don't have formal paperwork on that support Amateur Radio emergency communications in some organized manner... The Governor has said that he 'certainly doesn't need to rely on ham radio' -- where does that leave the RACES program now?"

"I am ashamed tonight that I am a Republican!" remarked one ham radio viewer. "[Romney] speaks in derogatory tones about hams. He certainly shows an ignorance as to what we do and are capable of. I suggest a grass roots campaign of local hams calling the State House and The Governor's Office to protest."

The television program can be viewed at http://www.thebostonchannel.com/vide...06/detail.html.

[American Patriot]

I have come to the firm, and undeniable conclusion that our President should be...

Fred Thompson

And his Vice President Should be

Duncan Hunter...

(And I'm not the ONLY one)


To: Rick.Donaldson


9 posted on 12/24/2007 1:39:01 PM MST by Yaelle (FRED, the most intelligent choice)

[American Patriot]

Subject: We almost forgot!


I had almost forgotten....Old draft evaders never die, they just have a hair cut and shave.

The Clinton's.....From your Vietnam Era Veterans.



Bill &Hillary, 1970



BILL CLINTON's MILITARY CAREER


(Bill & Hillary - Grit your teeth before you read this!)


Bill Clinton registers for the draft on September 08, 1964, accepting

all contractual conditions of registering for the draft. Selective Service

Number is 326 46 228.


Bill Clinton classified 2-S on November 17, 1964.


Bill Clinton reclassified 1-A on March 20, 1968.


Bill Clinton ordered to report for induction on July 28, 1969.


Bill Clinton refuses to report and is not inducted into the military.


Bill Clinton reclassified 1-D after enlisting in the United States Army Reserves

on August 07, 1969, under authority of COL. E. Holmes.


Clinton signs enlistment papers and takes oath of enlistment.


Bill Clinton fails to report to his duty station at the University of

Arkansas ROTC, September 1969.


Bill Clinton reclassified 1-A on October 30, 1969, as

enlistment with Army Reserves is revoked by Colonel E. Holmes and Clinton

now AWOL and subject to arrest under Public Law 90-40

(2) (a) regisrant who has failed to report...remain liable for induction.


Bill Clinton's birth date lottery number is 311, drawn December 1, 1969, but

anyone who has already been ordered to report for induction is INELIGIBLE!



Bill Clinton runs for Congress (1974), while a fugitive from justice under

Public Law 90-40.


Bill Clinton runs for Arkansas Attorney General (1976), while a fugitive

from justice.


Bill Clinton receives pardon on January 21, 1977, from

President Carter.



Bill Clinton becomes the FIRST PARDONED FEDERAL FELON

ever to serve as President of the United States.



All these facts come from Freedom of Information requests,

public laws, and various books that have been published,

and have not been refuted by Clinton.



After the 1993 World Trade Center bombing, President Clinton promised that those responsible would be hunted down and punished.


After the 1995 bombing in Saudi Arabia, which killed five U.S.

military personnel, Clinton promised that those responsible would be

hunted down and punished.



After the 1996 Khobar Towers bombing in Saudi Arabia, which

killed 19 and injured 200 U.S. military personnel, Clinton promised

that those responsible would be hunted down and punished.



After the 1998 bombing of U.S. embassies in Africa, which

killed 224 and injured 5,000, Clinton promised

that those responsible would be hunted down and punished.



After the 2000 bombing of the USS Cole, which killed 17 and injured 39

U.S. sailors, Clinton promised that those responsible be hunted down and punished.



Maybe if Clinton had kept those promises, an estimated 3,000 people in

New York and Washington, DC. who are now dead would be alive today.



THINK ABOUT IT!

It is a strange turn of events.

Hillary gets $8 Million for her forthcoming memoir.

Bill gets about $12 Million for his memoir yet to be written.

This from two people who spent 8 years being unable to recall

anything about past events while under oath.


Sincerely,

Cdr. Hamilton McWhorter USN (ret)


P.S.

Please forward this to as many people as you can! We don't want this woman to even THINK of running for President!

[Ryan Ruck]

Here's that accompanying image Rick.